PR Friday

Howdy everyone. PR Friday — post your weights lifted, gained, or consumed to the comments. There are lots of ideas we have for the website and writing posts, but you’re always welcome to submit ideas as well. Have a jolly weekend.

Here is some snatch footage of the super heavyweight lifters (110+ kg) from the 1989 World Weightlifting Championships to keep you occupied:


Feedback and Kroc Rows

I received the following e-mail from Heidi, one of the owners of Amarillo Strength and Conditioning (aka CrossFit Amarillo);

Justin,
<br/.
I just had to write you to report what has transpired at our gym in the few days following your 70s Big Workshop. Despite the fact that only a fraction of our athletes were in attendance, word spread like wildfire concerning the importance of strength training. Even though we preach this message to our athletes on a daily basis, I think it took someone else to walk in and bring some credibility to our rant. Anyhow, in the last two days we have had some deep discussion about strength training on our blog. Damn near every person at our gym (except for a handful) has decided to begin Starting Strength or your old WFAC CrossFit Program (we dub "S&C" – we always give you credit). Males and Females alike are finally starting to get it! I just wanted to let you know that your workshop was quite effective at informing folks about the importance of strength work, as well as, dispelling the myths associated with strength work. We would recommend that any gym would benefit from hosting a 70's Big Workshop.

Thanks again,

Heidi Coffman
CrossFit Amarillo
Amarillo Strength and Conditioning
www.amarillosc.com

If you live in the Amarillo area, I’d check out this gym. The members are all pals and the place had a great atmosphere. Quite a few of the coaches have also attended Mark Rippetoe’s Starting Strength Seminar, and that means they are quite learn-ed in this kind of stuff.

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My buddy Mike has been training for years by himself, whether it be when he was deployed to Afghanistan or when he was stationed in England. One thing is for sure; he did a lot of Kroc rows. He wanted to add to the grip discussion since he has pretty decent grips attached to his monkey arms. Bur first, here’s a little vid on what Kroc rows are all about:

We mentioned Kroc rows the other day, but I think they’re worth mentioning again. I always found the most benefit from doing one set to failure with straps. If you look at what Kroc does on his heaviest set, he is using straps, and going all out until there is nothing left. Is there a sufficient amount of body English? Yes. However the point here is to train until failure and increase the number of reps and/or weight every time you do them. Some might say the straps are counterproductive, and to them I pose this question; is being able to do a set of Kroc rows with 100 for a strict set of 8 sans straps more impressive and beneficial to your grip, or is a set of 125 for 15 reps? I guarantee that you won’t achieve the same amount of fatigue in your grip or forearms as you would doing the higher weight and reps.

I would say that Kroc rows would need to be programmed into your training at the end of your session when you aren’t pulling during the following 48 hours and it is preferable to have a few days of rest afterwards. A high intensity set of Kroc rows will be draining, but they are very beneficial to a stronger grip.

I also like to use the Captains of Crush grippers — I recently let Brent borrow these, and I am also interested to see how they help his predicament. First of all, using these grippers is not like sitting on your couch using the “grip tools” you find laying around most “fitness facilities.” These are the real deal. Don’t believe me? There are RECORD BOOKS for the two highest grippers. Using these grippers will definitely develop brutal crushing strength, and certainly assist in your ability to hang onto the bar during heavy pulls. When I started, I could close the trainer and the number 1. The number 2 was so hard for me initially I scoffed at it and focused on increasing my reps on the number 1. However, I eventually was able to close the number 2, and I could rep it out a few times. I believe these also took my grip strength to another level. Before using them I recall rack pulling in the low 500’s and having some grip issues after a couple reps. After using them for a few months I had no problem in the low 500’s, up until about 550-560. I was also told that my hand shake felt a lot more powerful. I think it would be generally agreed upon that someone who is 70’s Big undoubtedly should have an overpowering handshake.

Quick Points On Grip Strength

I’ll be the first to admit that I don’t know something, and something that I don’t know a whole lot about is grip strength. However, I have a few pointers that may help you include it in your training.

Brent mentioned Chris’ impressive hook grip, but Chris is not the only person to implement a double overhand hook grip (DOHG).Brad Gillingham pulling 881 DOHGY style.



The ease of being able to hold onto a deadlift is dependent on your grip strength, but, as with all of lifting, it is dependent on your anthropometry as well. The anthropometry in question is the total hand size, palm size, and finger length. Larger hands will make deadlifting easier because the circumference of the bar is relatively smaller. On the other hand, smaller hands will make holding onto a bar more difficult because it is analogous to a larger handed man deadlifting with a fat bar (or at least a “fatter bar”). This is the same reason why women’s weightlifting bars are of a smaller circumference of men; they have smaller hands.

This is another reason why not everyone can implement the hook grip; they may not have the hand size to successfully do so. Chris is one of those guys who has some large hands (he calls them “his grips”), and for some reason his thumbs aren’t damaged by the hook grip (we’ll get to this later). Brent, on the other hand, is a 5’5” Korean who has hands like a child. If he is capable of DOHGing his max deadlift, which I don’t think he is, then he will have to work very hard towards that goal.
Total hand size is then broken down into two characteristics: palm size and finger size. Someone can have decently sized hands, but then have shorter fingers with large palms (this describes my hands). In contrast, someone can have very long fingers with a smaller palm area. I’m not sure if this poses a problem for holding onto a barbell – it would seem like it would be the ideal situation.

Now let’s say you have some decently sized hands and you still can’t make DOHG work. In this case, your thumbs probably hurt like a mofo when you try it. Well, as with most things, you’ll have to get adapted to it. Chris was an Olympic weightlifter before he got into powerlifting, so he was comfortable early on with the hook grip. When he trained his deadlift, he naturally used the DOHG. I would even surmise that he used it when he was weaker, and as he got stronger he continued using the DOHG. I know that in the time that I have coached him and trained with him his deadlift has gone from the mid 400’s for reps to the low to mid 600’s – all with a DOHG. This means that A) his hand size permitted him to use the DOHG and B) his DOHG strength adapted with his pulling strength.

But is the DOHG any more impressive than an alternated grip? I guess since the hands are both pronated it makes the rep look more awesome. But remember, the hook grip is used so that A) grip strength isn’t a factor in the lift and B) it allows the grip muscles (that cross the wrist while some also attach at the elbow) to relax and allow the wrist and elbow to pass through their ranges of motion more easily when doing the snatch or the clean. Since these muscles are not all contracting, it makes holding onto the bar easier. Regarding the deadlift, it also prevents any of the imbalances that can occur from having one forearm supinated (whether it be mechanical or anatomical problems). In other words, it makes the deadlift more efficient and safe, and this is why you should use it if you can. But does that mean it’s more impressive? I don’t know. It may be that Chris will need to switch to an alternated grip when his deadlift gets heavier (we have talked about this), but I don’t think he’ll need to. Time will tell as his career progresses.

Regarding grip strength in general, it usually isn’t something a novice should be worrying about. Pull your deadlift warm-ups with an overhand grip and it will improve over time. If you’re able to DOHG it, go ahead, but otherwise alternate your grip when necessary. Both of these methods will still improve your grip strength, although I don’t know by how much. The alternated grip will require the finger flexors to work much harder than in the hook, but this may not be more of a detriment. Remember that an alternated grip makes the bar easier to hold onto because your hands apply torque to the bar in two different directions. This prevents the bar from rolling in any one direction as your hands weaken and probably improves the coefficient of friction as a result.

If you are unable to keep a hold on your deadlifts regardless of the method, then you are probably underweight. Double check this fact by stepping on the scale, and once you are sure, absolutely positive you are a strapping adult male, then we’ve got some weird problems because most decently sized guys can hang onto decent amounts of weight. Nevertheless, we need you to get stronger ASAFP. If you limit your deadlift because you can’t hang onto the bar, then you are also limiting your squat, your muscle mass increases, your hormones from going all crazy to help you grow, and thus you’re indirectly affecting your other lifts. Obviously you need to use straps. You need to be strong NOW.

But they don’t allow straps in meets, so you’ll have to get this shit figured out soon if you’re wanting to compete. In which case you go to the grip gurus and ask them – that ain’t me (Gant will be writing an article for this soon, so be patient). Sure, it’d be great to have your cake (the big deadlift) and eat it too (no straps), but you may be deficient in one of those areas. Get strong, and then worry about the grip later.
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I wouldn’t say the “no straps subculture” (how the hell did we start calling this a subculture, Brent?) is like the “no belts subculture”. The “no belts” guys are just stupid and/or ignorant and usually not very strong. The “no straps” guys are usually veteran lifters who are pretty damn strong. Don’t confuse the two, and don’t insult the “no straps” guys.

But even “no straps” guys would have to agree that they have their use. If you are pretty damn strong in the rack pull, then you will run into a grip problem. There are guys that can rack pull hundreds of pounds more than they can deadlift. If your grip is the limiting factor on an assistance exercise, then you better use straps to allow the relevant muscles to bear the load (erectors of the back, lats, hamstrings, etc.). Not to mention that it is preferable to use an overhand grip in pulling assistance exercises (like rack pulls, halting deadlifts, stiff legged deadlifts, Romanian deadlifts, etc.) because it works the muscles in symmetry and also prevents any asymmetry related injuries to occur (e.g. straining or tearing a biceps tendon).

Regarding Brent’s inquiries about Kroc Rows and wearing a shirt, I’ll let my friend Mike comment on the rows tomorrow. But for fuck’s sake, keep your shirt on if you’re in a gym you don’t own.

Double overhand hook grip deadlifts?

Hey man,

After seeing Chris pull, I think a lot of us have come to feel that there is a certain coolness to pulling heavy deadlifts with a double overhand hook grip. This is part of the reason why Chris’s deadlifts are so awesome, other than the fact that he collectively lifts more than a ton with his 5rm deadlift. There is something about possessing the grip strength to pull that kind of weight double overhand hook grip that, to me at least, equates to being a man, you know?

Hands strong enough to crush a moderately sized Asian? 70s big.

This post highlights another double overhand hook grip deadlifter, Mikhail Kokylaev. Kokylaev competes as a strongman, powerlifter, and weightlifter, and possesses a great diversity of athletic skills and types of strength. The video below displays his insanely strong pulling in addition to his equally insane grip.



If you go to his youtube page, you can see his other videos, and he’s pretty much a loose cannon, he’s just out of control. My favorites are his 200k push press triple and the 150k muscle snatch in an exhibition vid that a barbell club in the UK posted of him.

While having a ridiculously strong grip is appealing, it’s probably not wise to let the pursuit of great grip strength overshadow the primary goal of becoming strong, that is, through squats, presses, and pulling. I like to warm up with a double overhand hook grip as much as I can for all my pulling movements, usually up to my last warm up set, but Justin is always encouraging me, in the nicest possible way of course, to be smart about my grip and to not let my quest to be as cool as Chris overshadow my quest to be as strong as Brent Kim can possibly be.

Hopefully in the next article, Justin will weigh in on grip strength and how it relates to 70s big. If you have any questions on the topic, share them in the comments.

I’ve got a couple questions, actually:

– What’s the method of rectification for a guy trying to get 70s big whose grip is the limiting factor in his deadlifts/haltings/rack pulls?

– There’s a subculture in lifting, comparable to the “no belts” subculture, which espouses the ideal of never using straps for any exercise. Thoughts on straps in training?

– A while ago at a cookout at the WFAC, Gant recommended Kroc rows to me for, among other things, grip strength. Since Gant suggested I try them, and because Matt Kroczaleski does them and has a lot of super sweet vids on youtube of him doing them, I have of course been doing Kroc rows semi-religiously, sometimes without a shirt on. Thoughts on accessory exercises such as these? Perhaps thoughts on training without a shirt on?

Recap

The 70’s Big Workshop was pleasantly a success. Heidi and Kevin, the owners of Amarillo SC, were fantastic hosts and Ryan, who posts here on the comments regularly, brought a grill and cooked up a bunch of 70’s Big burgers and hotdogs for lunch. The crowd consisted of gym members who all have known each other for a while, and this created an amusing and fun atmosphere.


Some topics that we covered include what 70’s Big actually stands for, how strength augments all other physical attributes, training myths, the approach different sized people will have in order to get strong, injuries and setbacks, getting into your first competition, training quirks, and programming guidelines. We actually went over time, so there is room to trim the fat on some sections and condense the material. There were questions based on longevity as well as training for the “aging lifter/competitor”; the workshop itself will evolve based on what people want to learn about.

This workshop was the first of many, and we’d like to get around to help as much people as we can with their training, so if you’re interested in hosting a workshop, shoot me an e-mail. Also, if you are hoping to attend a workshop in the future, let us know what topics you would be chiefly interested in into the comments.

The next workshop is on May 15th in Allen, TX at CrossFit FX TX (you can sign up by going to the home page and clicking on the link to the workshop). Allen isn’t too far away from the Dallas/Fort Worth area, so we should have a nice crowd.

If you have any questions about the workshop(s), leave them in the comments. And don’t forget to post your TSC results in the Results Post.